Greensboro Aquatic Center coming together : News-Record.com : Greensboro & the Triad's most trusted source for local news and analysis

GREENSBORO — The most striking features in the late stages of construction at the Greensboro Aquatic Center are the huge concrete-and-tile pits.

Standing next to a 17-foot-deep diving well gives you a sense for what some athletes there will be doing.

Then you look up at the 10-meter diving platform above the hole and imagine staring down into water .

And it hits you — people jump off these things.

“You get up there and you’re scared,” Greensboro Coliseum Director Matt Brown said.

With two months before its expected opening date, the $19 million project is coming in on budget, said Brown, who led a tour Friday.

First stop: The warmup pool. It’s the most versatile space, open to the community for swimming lessons, available to top-caliber athletes to warm up at big meets and ready for the disabled, who can use a long roll-in ramp to enter the pool.

“It’s 3 to 4 feet deep and will be our warmest pool,” Brown said. “It will be our therapeutic pool.”

It will be a training pool, with an adjoining classroom where students can be shown a lesson and hop back in the water.

An elevated, glass-enclosed space will allow parents to watch practice. Moms and dads then can walk a short hallway to the main pool area, a cavernous space than can hold 22 short lanes or eight 50-meter lanes.

The wall between the two pools is half glass, so spectators can see competitors go from one space to another.

Above that wall will be a 24 by 19 foot video screen, which Brown said will be larger than the one at the swimming facility at Georgia Tech that hosted Olympic competition in 1996 .

A consistent 9- to 10-foot depth will ensure it’s a fast pool, Brown said, and extra deep gutters around the edge will reduce waves.

“It makes the outside lanes more competitive,” he said.

State of the art ultraviolet filtration devices will clean each pool, and minimize chlorine use, Brown said. That will save money and keep swimmers from having red eyes. There are separate heaters for each pool, too.

Along the 52.5-meter length of the competition pool were unfinished offices, lifeguard offices and conference rooms. Behind those are more locker rooms for adult swimmers.

On Friday, workers ambled through the spaces, glued tiles to the pool walls or rode lifts to the 66-foot-high ceiling to install ducts.

One worker sat in a future locker room with a saw jammed into the wall.

Another pulled wires through an electrical room that will be the nerve center for timing the events.

There’s still work left, but the place is obviously an aquatic center — not just a hole in the ground that motorists who passed the coliseum a few months ago may remember.

And then there’s the diving well.

Outside, those same drivers on High Point Road will be able to see divers climbing the stairs to platforms behind a glass wall.

There are no hot tubs for divers to warm up in, as some facilities have. It was a cost-cutting measure, Brown said.

The center will offer space for other events beyond swimming and diving.

“Synchronized swimming, we haven’t had that since Greensboro College started it in the ’60s,” said Kim Strable, head of the Greensboro Sports Commission. “And then water polo. There are people who have little pockets of interest, but you don’t have places for people to learn and to compete.”

Events have been stacking up there, but it’s not quite time yet to talk about hosting Olympic trials.

“We got to go after the national meets,” Brown said.

Contact Gerald Witt at 373-7008 or gerald.witt@news-record.com

buzzman

June 27, 2011 - 8:53 am EDT

This is just another money pit for the taxpayers of Greensboro. The elite will have their aquatic center on the backs of folks who can barely afford to keep up their homes and pay the taxes on them.
This albatross will never come close to breaking even. I'll go so far as to predict that it will one day stand empty as a monument to Brown's ego.

Mr. JMS

June 27, 2011 - 9:31 am EDT

I agree and I'll bet the operations budget has been way under estimated. The citizens of Greensboro have been lied to from day 1 on this money pit. It will be another money losing venture, taxpayers will have to subsidize from now on.

fisher

June 27, 2011 - 10:20 am EDT

Hypothetically....
If a weekend meet costs the GAC $10,000 to run, and the hotel taxes collected from the out-of-town visitors are $15,000, did the taxpayers win or lose?

terrier2003

June 27, 2011 - 10:40 am EDT

depending on who is swimming in the meet, but I remember having to pay entry fees which went to the facility and usswimming. So if run properly, the meets will pay for themselves through entry fees and the concessions and parking willl be additional income. Then you have the hotel taxes, the tax on the income the hotel recieves for rental of the room, the food tax, the tax on the income from the sale of food and gas tax.
I'll be interested in seeing how it does. I would also be interested in seeing that Brown doesn't try to get creative with the accounting and move money around to cover the arena's losses.

June 27, 2011 - 10:57 am EDT

Anyone can pull numbers from the air.
Hypothetically....
If a weekend meet cost the GAC $30,000 to run and the hotel taxes collect are $15,000, did the taxpayer win or lose?

June 27, 2011 - 11:30 am EDT

My point is that some will focus only on the GAC gain/loss and evaluate based on that.

June 27, 2011 - 2:37 pm EDT

I don't think it's very smart to count money that may (or may not) come in from hotel taxes, to creat a budget.

June 27, 2011 - 9:54 am EDT

Only time will tell. However, the lady who is running this center also Ran Baha Mar in FL and it self sustained from the usswimming Jr. Nationals and other major meets. They already have the YMCA nationals coming with a lot of swimmers. If the facility is good, water is fast and spectator seating ample they will have many other larger meets there. I don't think this will be a drain on the tax payers...but only time will tell.

copper1

June 27, 2011 - 10:12 am EDT

Buzzman, you are correct. This community bathtub will be another "money pit" for all the hard working taxpayers. If you combine the loses from the "white elephant" next door, Matt Brown could rewrite the record books on taxpayer support. What was this years request.....1.6 million from the general fund.

Fact Checker

June 27, 2011 - 3:14 pm EDT

Before you can say the Coliseum "cost" the city $1.6 million, you must first know how much money went into the general fund as a result of the Coliseum. If the Coliseum contributes about $54 million to the local economy, the City breaks even. It is estimated that the Coliseum contributes about $100,000,000 to the local economy. The YMCA swim meet announced recently generated about $15,000,000 per year to Ft. Lauderdale before it moved to Greensboro.
The only thing that Matt Brown and the Coliseum can be criticized for is not challenging misinformation that suggests the Coliseum loses money.

tomtom

June 27, 2011 - 9:04 am EDT

i think you are right. more taxes.the poor working people.and that would be me.

Hyatt

June 27, 2011 - 9:24 am EDT

I am excited about the whole thing. What people don't realize is that the swimming community is huge. Much like travel soccer, AAU etc. these athletes travel cross country to compete. Good job Greensboro.

June 27, 2011 - 9:55 am EDT

I agree 100%.

DonMoore

June 27, 2011 - 9:42 am EDT

Fortunately, much of the operating losses will be offset by the parking fees paid by the daily swimmers who practice at the facility. (I just hope they don't try to car pool from say the mall, to save parking fees.)

walker

June 27, 2011 - 1:59 pm EDT

The project is "on budget?" Ummmmm, excuse me, but wasn't the initial projection (the one the public voted on) $10 million, before City Council bailed the project out by approving another $9 million? This project will be almost 100 percent OVER the initially approved budget. Finally, does anyone really believe we will ever get an accurate accounting from the Coliseum poobahs? Please.

June 27, 2011 - 2:05 pm EDT

Exactly!!!! Nail on the head!!!! Right on the money!!!!

jfk3

June 27, 2011 - 2:12 pm EDT

Some of you guys never miss a chance to complain. This project was voted on by the public... as a Parks & Rec bond no less. The Coliseum staff took on the project after the fact when it was determined that they could run it more efficiently than any other city dept on the current Coliseum footprint. That story doesn't jive with the with the preferred storyline that Matt Brown is this evil, all-powerful boogeyman out to financially destroy the city. You fiscal watchdogs should focus your efforts on those more reckless pieces of the city budget. The library, tranportation and parks depts all hit the city's bottom line much harder than the coliseum with much less economic benefit to the city.

June 27, 2011 - 2:34 pm EDT

Look, now that we are spending $19 million I hope the project is a great success. But here ae some facts: (1) After failing twice, the aquatic center was tied to a Parks and Rec bond in an effort to be far less than transparent (deceptive?). Its the only way that they could get the initial funding approved. Shame on the voters for not seeing through this. (2) Do you really believe that the Coliseum folks weren't the drivers behind this project from Day #1? Was Parks and Rec ever going to run this facility? No way. Maybe this is/was a great idea, but no one....not the Coliseum, City Council, consultants....behaved honestly and in good faith. Nor did they keep the public truthfully informed. BTW....I stand corrected as I believe the accurate figures are as follows: The initial bond was for $12 million and Council was asked to approve (and did) an additional $6 million. I'm not sure where the additional $1 million is coming from. And full disclosure....no....regardless of what we're told, I don't believe that the total cost will stop at $19 million.

June 27, 2011 - 2:42 pm EDT

Good post walker.
The so called "Park and Rec" bond for a swiming center would have never pasted as a Coliseum expansion project, which is what this really is. They lied and the taxpayers are the ones holding the bill.

jdspringer

June 27, 2011 - 3:25 pm EDT

Nobody "lied" to the taxpayers. Most of them were just too lazy or stupid to read the bond proposal. I did and voted against it, but don't tell me anyone "lied". It was right there in black and white for anyone who had half a brain to read.

The problem with Guilford County is that too many people here sit back and do nothing and then complain when something they were too lazy too do anything about happened. The official sport of Guilford County is whining, and these letters bring out the same people -- who do nothing about anything they complain about -- in numbers every time. It's like chum in the water.

June 27, 2011 - 4:41 pm EDT

Now you're lying. NO WHERE did the bond say the Coliseum and Matt Brown would be running the swimming center. NO WHERE did the bond say the swim center was going to be on coliseum property (making this a coliseum expansion project). and NO WHERE did the bond say the project was going to cost $19 million plus.

June 27, 2011 - 5:10 pm EDT

No, but that's not what you and the rest of these yahoos are claiming is a lie. You've all been claiming that people didn't know the aquatics center was in the bond. Anyone who says that is a lie.

I didn't care who was going to be running it or where it was going to be built or how much it was going to cost. I just didn't want to pay for it.

Are you telling me you WOULD have voted for an aquatics center if it wasn't going to be built at the coliseum and run by Matt Brown? No, you wouldn't have voted for one either way, and that's fine. That's your right as a voter. But the aquatics center was in the bond, and anyone who says they were lied to about that fact was lazy or stupid.

If you don't like the way it turned out after the bond passed, talk to your city council member or the White Knight who was supposed to save us from all of these scams. The only voter he's served since he got elected was Busby Burckley.

June 27, 2011 - 5:54 pm EDT

The devil is in the details and if the voters were not given those very important details they could not make educated vote. Those details were deliberately hiden from the public. That as good as a LIE.
And Mayor Knight has done exactly what he was elected by the people to do. He has made every effort and has tried to reduce the reckless spending of the city. He is not King of Greensboro. He is only 1 person on the city council. But he has accomplished much to that goal.

June 27, 2011 - 3:04 pm EDT

I fully believe that the public gets the government they deserve. The electorate is largely uneducated on the things/people they vote on... you won't get an argument from me on that point. Still, the public passed the bond, and the publically-elected council approved the various funding changes. The evil Matt Brown theory just doesn't hold water. His job is to run and promote the Coliseum to the best of his ability, and he/his staff does an unbelievable job on that task. Don't blame the coliseum for the electorate's misguided voting tendancies.

I'm a very conservative person, but I realize that a city needs attractions that put it on the map.. things that make the city appear attractive to businesses, retirees, etc. The Coliseum Complex is just about the only nationally-recognized thing this city has going for it. When I travel to other parts of the country and tell people where I'm from, they generally respond with comments on the ACC/NCAA tournament or the Wyndham. They don't say "boy your library system is stellar" or "your buses are the cleanest I've ever ridden in." The coliseum actually brings visitors to our area. That can be priceless promotion... certainly worth the $1.6 million annual outlay.

sail

June 27, 2011 - 4:17 pm EDT

Look, Matt Brown is no different then any other businessman. If the City is willing to hand him a blank check without accountability, he has every right to take it.
The Coliseum is an entertainment venue, not an economic development strategy that creates jobs. Right now, Greensboro needs jobs.
The debate should not be weather the Coliseum is good or bad for Greensboro. The debate should be focused on weather it’s fair for the tax payers to pick up the tab every year for the Coliseum loses. Expand if you’re making money or even if you’re breaking even; however, not when you’re hemorrhaging millions every year.
For the record--
The citizens/tax payers of Greensboro were mislead. The bonds ($20 million) they approved were for parks/recs to build a new community swimming pool ($12 million) and various miscellaneous maintenance projects. A few weeks after the election approving the bonds, the pool project was moved out of parks/recs to the Coliseum. At the time, an aquatic center was not on the public radar screen. However, you can draw your on conclusion as to weather Brown, Matheny or Perkins knew about the plans for the aquatic center. This was a bait and switch tactic, a typical City Council/Matt Brown maneuver.
The $12 million budget quickly turned into $18 million with the additional $6 million to be funded out of the Hotel/Motel Occupancy tax. The aquatic center is now $2 million over budget. The first year planned deficit has jumped from $100K to over $400K.
Further, aquatic centers have a long and consistent history of losing big bucks. The swim associations, both regional and national, literally dictate how much they are willing to pay. Brown and company have zero influence. They either except the contract or the swim meet organizers move to an aquatic center that will.
There is absolutely no way the aquatic center will ever come close to breakeven.
How is the Coliseum Complex good for Greensboro?? Who benefits from the Coliseum?? Not the tax payer. Hotels, motels, restaurants----maybe---but how much?? How much sales tax revenue is the City gaining?? Right, your guess is as good as anyone’s.
Bottom line, the Coliseum is a money loser. The Coliseum has lost money every year for the past 16 consecutive years, over $28 million (not counting the aquatic center), all subsidized with Greensboro tax dollars.
And yes, they do have another $1.5 million deficit planned in the 2011/2012 City Budget.
But, is that enough??? Now they have another mysterious project called the Amphitheater, nobody knew about it---except Brown, Matheny and Perkins. No budget, just another belligerent grab from the tax payer. First it was $95K, now it’s over $800K---and they’re not finished. When will the hemorrhaging stop? It’s up to the voters.
Just remember, when someone tells you the Coliseum is good for Greensboro, ask them why? Is it economic development?? Hmm! Wonder how many jobs the Coliseum creates?? Not many, you can count them on one hand.
For anyone willing to listen, Greensboro has bigger fish to fry then expanding the Coliseum. Why expand when you’re losing money? Simple answer, it’s not their money.
Why expand when the economy is in a ditch? Simple answer, it’s not their money.
How about planning a viable economic development strategy designed to put Greensboro citizens back to work with decent paying jobs?
Who knows, maybe then the tax payers will have enough disposable income to enjoy events at their own Coliseum.
No sour grapes here, just logic.
Putting the cart in front of the horse never works.
Build it and they will come, only works when the economy is booming.

June 27, 2011 - 5:24 pm EDT

sail - certainly you aren't suggesting that the coliseum has no economic impact on the community... you can debate how much the impact is, but to suggest that there isn't any at all is intellectually dishonest. we're talking about less than 1% of the city's budget here. for that less than 1% expense, greensboro gets a unique world-class facility that is just about the only meaningful nationally-known attraction in town. as a taxpayer in this community, i'm willing to pay less than 1% for an attraction that brings visitors and the spotlight to our city. its certainly a better return on investment than libraries that sit idle other than web surfers, or an ungodly amount of parks that receive relatively few visitors/year, or nearly-empty buses that roam our community, or (especially) schools that spend as much on back-office bureacrats as they do on actually teaching the children. i've seen this city's bureaucracy at work close up, and the coliseum is the least of our worries.

for the sake of comparison, there isn't (to my knowledge) a coliseum our size in the country that breaks even w/o a major league team paying rent. in fact, most similar facilities lose much more than ours on a yearly basis.

as far as the pool is concerned, don't forget that its a facility that the citizens will get much use out of. the events that come through will be a nice boost to the bottom line, but the underprivileged elementary students that learn to swim, the disabled citizens that will take therapy there, and the community swim associations will be the real beneficiaries of the facility. its the first new city pool built in something like 30+ years (since smith).

June 28, 2011 - 2:54 pm EDT

jfk3---sorry this response is a bit tardy, I was busy being "Intellectually Dishonest"--- relax, just kidding; however, you did take a cheap shot at me.
Sorry if you missed the line:
“How is the Coliseum Complex good for Greensboro?? Who benefits from the Coliseum?? Not the tax payer. Hotels, motels, restaurants----maybe---but how much?? How much sales tax revenue is the City gaining?? Right, your guess is as good as anyone’s.”
Does this statement suggest that my position indicates there is zero economic impact to the City? Come on, everyone is entitled to their opinion. Can we please stay on topic and focus on the facts we have at hand?
Even when the Coliseum had pro team support back in the late 90's they lost money. You're right; most Coliseum enterprises run by local governments lose money. Many Cities around the US are backing away from running commercial enterprise. It appears there is a growing purging process beginning to take root where the City leases the facility to private business and some are divesting themselves of all assets. Charlotte Regional Visitors Authority (CRVA) makes money with their deal with the NBA. Bobcats run all front end activities and the City maintains the facility, or back end. However, all other Charlotte Coliseum facilities lose big money. Durham’s Performing Arts Center is owned by the City of Durham, but managed by Nederlander/PFM, a partnership combining Durham and Nederlander. This is a profit sharing partnership that has resulted in a positive share position. Nederlander is the world’s largest owner and producer of Broadway shows. Cary has an aquatic center, “Triangle Aquatic Center (TAC). The center is set up as a non for profit charity, is privately funded through community support and donations. They are at breakeven, or slightly in the black.
This is where I personally have a problem. The cultural political scene in Greensboro encourages slight of hand. The tactics used to expand the Coliseum Complex is under the table, they consistently stay hidden behind the curtain. The business plan/construction budget is designed to initiate the approval process. They break ground, spend money and then return to the trough for more. In private sector business, that would be grounds for termination. After 16 years they should have figured out a workable model. It is easy to assume the Coliseum adds value to Greensboro and the surrounding area. What is the measurement? How do we know weather this investment is working? Please tell me if you now if any company that has re-located to Greensboro because of the national exposure we receive from the Coliseum?
At the risk of being intellectually dishonest, all I am attempting to do is draw attention to the facts. You sighted libraries, parks, empty buses and a flawed public school system as examples of significant waste and far more of an issue then the Coliseum. It’s not that I disagree with you; frankly I do agree with you and could quickly add to the list. However, the topic was the aquatic center.
Greensboro is in desperate need of a strategic over-haul, a long over due economic transformation. I believe this effort can be funded by re-deploying massive frivolous spending to strategic investments in infrastructure. If we don't figure out a way to pull us out of this tail spin, having a viable Coliseum will not matter.
I attended the Beach Boys concert a few weeks ago. Clearly, no debate on the facility or the tunes; however, the beer was outrageously expensive. I did have a great time and took the time to say that to Matt. A short television interview followed; and again, my comments were positive. However, please know that my position remains the same. Before expanding an enterprise that has a long history of losing money, figure out how to breakeven. They have plenty of events and overall annual attendance; possibly, it is the quality of the events that needs work. I’m not talking about basketball or skating.
The quick fix appears to be simple. Look at the deficit and the annual attendance.
In 2010, we’re taking about another $1.04 per head.
Cary has an interesting model. Those that are interested in swimming can support the aquatics center and those that would prefer another entertainment venue can peruse another opportunity. The Council for the City of Greensboro holds all the citizens of Greensboro hostage to support the Coliseum, regardless of weather they benefit from the investment.

swimmom

June 27, 2011 - 8:04 pm EDT

I'm looking forward to seeing my 2 children and their friends compete in this awesome facility. Thank you Greensboro! You annexed my neighborhood just in time to cast a vote for this project :-)

June 28, 2011 - 3:11 pm EDT

Happy to hear that some will benefit from this $20 million pool.
Unfortunately, only a few will benefit; however, all will pay.
Don't get me wrong, I swam competitively when I was a kid, a great sport and enriching experience.
But, my parents footed the bill for us kids, not the tax payer.

WaterBaron

June 27, 2011 - 9:13 pm EDT

The Randleman Dam scam is EXHIBIT A for what happens every time in Greensboro when a completed city project does not live up to all the hype that fueled its approval.

Greensboro pitched THE DAM as the only solution to keep the city from running out of water. But Greensboro was never running out of water and water sales were declining every year while the dam was being justi-lied! Those FACTS were being concealed to allow the Randleman Dam to get permitted and funded.

Water demand TODAY is LESS than what it was in 1995 when the city claimed the sky was falling! Greensboro water sales are in a 16-year DECLINE and nobody knows thanks to a city that conceals the truth and spineless local news media outlets that refuse to report City of Greensboro fraud.

The city's hyped-up future water needs forecast that justi-lied the dam were a disaster! The projections were off by a few light years and the gross error was never reported by the city’s “media accomplices.”

The LIFE LESSON: Greensboro's citizens should never trust anything they read about a POOL, an AMPHITHEATER, Project Homestead, the proposed Gate City Bobsled Run, the future Curling Center and every other project the city dreams up and tricks its citizens into funding.

For more of the TRUTH about the city's worst fraud—the Randleman Dam Scam, simply Google two words—dam scam.

news-record.com

SPORTS