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NEWS

Panel backs S. Elm Street hotel project

Tuesday, December 22, 2009

A proposed downtown luxury hotel has cleared the first hurdle with the city.

The Greensboro Redevelopment Commission agreed to sell 2.8 acres of South Elm Street redevelopment land to the Ole Asheboro Association, a nonprofit that hopes to turn the site into a 200-room hotel with the help of a developer. The sale price would be $1.1 million. The City Council will be asked to approve the sale Jan. 5. 

The project is contingent on the council approving a complicated $47 million financing deal. Most of that sum would come from low-interest bonds made available to the city and county through the federal economic stimulus effort. The council is scheduled to consider the financing Jan. 5, as well.

The five member redevelopment commission was split on  the project. “They are not asking for us today to do this, but to give them a chance to put this thing together,” said commission member Nettie Coad, a resident of Ole Asheboro and chairwoman of the commission.

“I think it deserves the chance. We won’t lose anything if we vote for it and it doesn’t work. Southeast Greensboro needs to stop being the dumping ground for everybody.”

The 10 acre site at the south of Lee Street along South Elm Street is a “brownfield” site where the city planned to build a mixture of housing, retail and office space.

Instead, members of the Ole Asheboro neighborhood and the developer asked the commission to sell a piece of the land for a seven-story hotel. The neighborhood association would have a 15 percent share in the hotel and get a portion of the profits.

Proponents, including state Rep. Alma Adams and school board member Deena Hayes, asked the commission to approve the sale.

“I think this is going to be a wonderful opportunity not only for jobs, but to improve the economic development,” Adams said. “Here’s an opportunity that I think we ought to seize.”

A majority of commission members thought so too, although two members were concerned that giving the prime land to the hotel would weaken the overall redevelopment project.

“It’s meant to be a development in total and not in pieces,” said commission member Jerry Leimenstoll.

The approval from the commission is the first step toward the hotel development. But the city staff raised questions about the project’s viability that will have to be answered before the proposal becomes reality. A city-commissioned marketing study found that the proposed $200-per-room rate — and upward of 70 percent room occupancy expected by the developer — was not feasible.

Bridge Chisholm, partner in Urban Hotel Group, disagreed with the findings. If the sale moves forward, the city would enter into an agreement that would require the developer to provide conceptual plans for the hotel, financial commitment and proof of a commitment from a hotel franchise.
 

Contact Amanda Lehmert at 373-7075 or amanda.lehmert@news-record.com

Accompanying Photos

John Newsom (News & Record)

Comments

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AcTiOnJaXn

December 22, 2009 - 2:14 am EST

City needs to take a good look at this one... It's realy questionable. The Double Tree Hilton down the road never gets 200 a night and are rarely at a 70% occupancy. As a matter of fact the entire staff took a 7% pay cut earlier this year and This is a Hilton. I would do my research on this developer. Unless he's building a extended stay property he's full of hot air. A 7 story building? It might have What? 150 or 200 rooms. We'd be lucky to get 15 part-time minimum wage jobs from that. Do your research Greensboro! Not trying to be a joykill but this sounds like a scam to me.

thefinanceguy

December 23, 2009 - 9:42 am EST

Seems to be some conflicts of interest with Miss Nettie - Ole Ashboro - and the RCG? And is this legal? Can RCG just cut a deal with one group? What happened to the Plan? Why not put this out for bid - let the Medicine woman and her team bid. Miss Nettie - are you and your neighborhood sharing in the losses with your 15% ownership?

luvdowntowngso

December 22, 2009 - 5:59 am EST

I want this hotel to be build so we can all watch it fail together! With only a few exceptions, locally owned and operated hotels fail! I'd feel so much better if this were a national hotel group. I'm a major supporter of the revitalization of downtown but I do not support this project!

nclawkid

December 22, 2009 - 10:06 am EST

I agree. I think this proposal has some serious challenges, and I would much rather see mixed use and affordably priced units where this hotel is supposed to go.

gsostudent

December 22, 2009 - 3:26 pm EST

Does Greensboro really need any more housing? People need homes but we have a ridiculously high vacancy rate in this City. We can do better.

wscbd

December 22, 2009 - 1:45 pm EST

Let me get this straight - You "luv" downtown, but you want this major economic development project to fail? And if you think it's destined to fail because it's locally owned, I'd advise you to have a talk with Dennis Quaintance.

luvdowntowngso

December 23, 2009 - 6:04 am EST

wscbd, can't you read? As I said "with the exception of a few cases..." Dennis is who I had in mind when typing this! Duh!? The developer of this project is NOT a "Dennis Q" when it comes to business sense! Not even close!

wscbd

December 23, 2009 - 8:25 am EST

The entire point of my comment was that first sentence, which you conveniently ignored. I, for one, have been waiting for southward growth. I own several homes within a couple of blocks of this site and can't wait for more economic development there.

jeffic_fail

December 22, 2009 - 6:58 am EST

I hope I am wrong, but I don't forsee this project being successful. I think we need more downtown attractions before building a luxury hotel. What incentives would people have to stay there?

buzzman

December 22, 2009 - 7:08 am EST

I completely agree with all the above comments! Greensboro doesn't need a downtown hotel. There is no way that more than a few guests will spend $200 for a room. Look at the players in this ridiculous proposal. Can you say "Project Homestead?!?!"

hugh

December 22, 2009 - 8:12 am EST

Development doctrine via Hollywood. "If you build it, they will come".

thefinanceguy

December 22, 2009 - 4:00 pm EST

And if they are new in town - they get preference - check the track records of the investors

Rick

December 22, 2009 - 9:46 am EST

Wow, a swim center, a ballpark, a coliseum, and now a luxury hotel. (Isn't unemployment over 10% with a depressed housing market?) Some lucky builder is going to make at least 47 million. I wonder who our city council is really representing?

UNBELEIVABLE

December 22, 2009 - 9:56 am EST

Okay...City of Greensboro please wake up from your delusions that this will somehow spark a beautiful community that will attract visitors galore to Greensboro. There are already way too many hotels in Greensboro that are not able to meet their budgets and are unable to keep a full staff of employees in order to provide great service so visitors will return to spend their money in Greensboro. With occupancies in Greensboro hotels ranging on average of 50%, this clearly makes no sense. Already existing luxury properties like Grandover, Proximity and O'Henry sit empty and then you have the dinosaur Convention Center that sits empty for series of weeks. The city needs to seek the consult of professionals that are knowledgeable in this industry and have no interest in the project and let them tell you that this will be a complete failure. If the city thinks that they are going to get their Bureau sales people to fill this hotel...that's a crazy delusion too!

wscbd

December 23, 2009 - 10:03 am EST

"i" before "e", except after "c".

AcTiOnJaXn

December 24, 2009 - 1:29 am EST

My sentiments exactly!

Dogwood

December 22, 2009 - 10:11 am EST

Greensboro has had a government planned hotel before. Royal Villa went broke within ten years. The rooms were chopped up into condos. The condos went broke. Economically challenged and disabled where moved in. I think the luxury hotel is now empty. I need Jim Schlosser's help in remembering all the details and dates.

AirDoc

December 22, 2009 - 10:33 am EST

Folks, this is a train wreck of a money pit for sure. To say that we stand to lose nothing if this project is built and then fails is idiotic. If you know most of the players in this wreck, you can easily realize that this is bad politics at its worst. No special interest groups should be permitted to submit stats for this project - it is obvious such numbers have been slanted and spun to make this project appear as a rose garden. All numbers need to come from unbiased reliable sources, much unlike they are now. Watch this one closely.

Bosco

December 22, 2009 - 10:41 am EST

Enough of this. Run this con artist out of town before Greensboro is stuck holding a bag of bonds

thefinanceguy

December 23, 2009 - 9:45 am EST

Agreed - I read the links below re Memphis - Ms. Chisolm was not the developer - and has learned to manipulate public finance and the MBE process. The neighborhood is being taken for a ride; we will end up eating the bonds; and Ole Asheboro will lose - I predict increase in vacany and unemployment over 20%. Good going Miss Nettie!

maxinedog

December 22, 2009 - 11:18 am EST

To paraphrase a recent movie quote, "The people who are pushing for this tax dollar give away are so stupid they don't even merit insult." This will make Project Homestead look like a gret investment, my suspicion is that the same people who supportted "Rev. King" will be pushing for this project, some of them are still politically powerful. Ask any Hotel Operator to put odds on a 70% occupancy rate, at $200/night, especially in that location. If Proximity and the O Henry can't achieve those numbers, what justifies this fantasy?

Elmer

December 22, 2009 - 11:48 am EST

This is the crazy kind of project that couldn't stand on its own. Does anyone have STR reports for Greensboro? I'm sure the CVB does, but this doesn't seem to have been shared. I wonder what the REVPAR is for hotels in this segment in this market.

BTW, anyone ever notice the the print N&R's classified employment category for this segment? Motels& Restaurants. "Classyfied" indeed.

gsoattorney

December 22, 2009 - 2:58 pm EST

This is insane, and worse yet, its wrong. Quaintance Weaver raised their own capital to build luxury hotels. Other privately built and owned hotels also serve the downtown market. And we are going to contribute public property and financing to build a facility to compete with them? When will people realize, if you let politicians pick economic winners and losers through a political process, everyone comes out a loser, except the politicians. the N & R could do the community a service by looking at the people involved with the proposed developer (the identity of the operator is probably irrelevant since they will be bankrupt in 5 years anyway, the developer is going to get their cash and get gone).

This is giving tax money to friends of politicians "using the peoples money to buy their votes."

"They have entered the treasury, not sword in hand, as public plunderers, but with the false keys of sophistry, as pilferers, under the silence of midnight. The motive and object are the same, varied in like manner, by character and circumstances. “With money I will get men, and with men, money,” was the maxim of the Roman plunderer. With money we will get partizans, with partizans votes, and with votes money, is the maxim of our public pilferers. With men and money, Caesar struck down Roman liberty, at the fatal battle of Phillippi [sic; perhaps Pharsalus], never to rise again ; from which disastrous hour, all the powers of the Roman republic were consolidated in the person of Caesar, and perpetuated in his line. With money and corrupt partizans, a great effort is now making to choke and stifle the voice of American liberty, through all its natural organs ; by corrupting the press ; by overawing the other departments ; and, finally, by setting up a new and polluted organ, composed of office holders and corrupt partizans, under the name of a national convention, which, counterfeiting the voice of the people, will, if not resisted, in their name dictate the succession ; when the deed will be done—the revolution be completed—and all the powers of our Republic, in like manner, be consolidated in the President, and perpetuated by his dictation. -- John C. Calhoun, in the Senate, January 13, 1834

jstevenh1952

December 22, 2009 - 3:05 pm EST

The probability of my remaks having any bearing on this is slim, but I progress.

The revenue per available room (rev-par) in this demo cannot support room rates much more that 135.00 on average. This was determined recently by a large( 4.5 billion in assets) real estate trust looking to invest in this area. Considering a 25% rate above market for "luxury" accommodations this tops at 180 to 185 rev-par. Far below the $200 rate noted. What is more this rate cannot compete with facilities offerring better locations and amenties (ie; Grandover and KCC).

The developer getting a francise tag has little merit. The risk of this deal will be absorbed by the bond issuer.

That's not all bad news, but it does little to justify building the property discussed. Assuming no bonds were available for financing, this project would never get off the ground.

Greensboro is getting ready to step into a bit of a mess and maybe doesn't know it. Think carefully. These are not non-recourse bonds and more is at stake that the writer is letting on. Nice idea, but most likely unrealistic expectations are being established.

gsostudent

December 22, 2009 - 3:23 pm EST

Is there really a need for more housing? If this project is going to cost so much money is it at least going to be green? If it's a luxury hotel it should at least go the way of The Proximity and be LEED Certified. I agree that this part of Greensboro needs more investment but I am highly skeptical of the need for another hotel.

jeaniegnc

December 22, 2009 - 3:24 pm EST

And when this is put to a vote before our city council, I would be willing to bet we have the same 5-4 vote in favor of doing this. I sure hope Nancy Vaughn and Zack Matheny are smart enough to realize that this town and this economy cannot support another whack at the taxpayers for something else to support.

For once, I hope someone insists on seeing hard impartial facts on just what is happening to the hotel/motel industry during this economy. Since we know that we have had to take $250,000.00 of taxpayer money and put it in their coffers, it does not sound promising. We keep being told by all of the pro-swim center fans that the additional money over $12. million will not cost the taxpayers but when we just lent them $250,000.00 that is hard to believe. City council, please use common sense on this issue.

Another bad idea is that Diane B. Small wants taxpayers to purchase the YWCA that is for sale. Do any of these people watch the news, read newspapers or try to keep up with what is happening in our country?

Elmer

December 22, 2009 - 3:34 pm EST

Are any pro-forma finacials for this project available? Wonder what the debt service would be? Wonder what the operating cash flow would be?

gsoattorney

December 22, 2009 - 3:41 pm EST

Urban Hotel Group LLC, formed June 19, 2006. Eric Martin Attorney (Banks Law Firm), attorney and organizer Bridget Chisolm is Agent and Manager, 616 Martin Street, GSO.

Bridget Chisolm is involved with a Downtown Hotel Project in Memphis – related to a controversial “redevelopment” project.

Marlon Phoenix is apparently one declared partner - see this story http://orlando.bizjournals.com/triad/stories/2009/07/06/tidbits1.html
And this one http://atlanta.bizjournals.com/atlanta/othercities/triad/stories/2009/07...
Though according to the stories Ms. Chisholm’s and Mr. Phoenix’s resumes might be a bit thin for their projects.

See this story http://www.commercialappeal.com/news/2009/jan/25/herenton-touch-midas-or... and this one http://www.memphisflyer.com/JacksonBaker/archives/2002/01/06/bridget-chi...

So you create the LLC, develop or flip the property, give or bargain sell membership interests in the LLC to necessary VIP’s and voila, a lot of public money is privatized. Old, old story.

Lastly, a little digging and scratching around Memphis might be educational – maybe it was nothing but Ms. Chisholm has been perceived, rightly or wrongly as seeking private benefit from public money before, see http://memphis.bizjournals.com/memphis/stories/2001/08/06/daily38.html

C’mon N&R, where’s the investigation – don’t just run the press release!

Bosco

December 22, 2009 - 5:04 pm EST

gso, this woman is a "medicine man", and found a gullible pond of fish ready to swallow hook, line and sinker. She should be politely asked to leave and not return. If not heeded, then completely exposed as the con artist she is. Those that support this deserve the ridicule that will follow.

thefinanceguy

December 22, 2009 - 3:58 pm EST

Interesting decision especially now as hotels are infinancable

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